We found it easy to get permits for this section. We called a few months in advance and our first choice weekend was available. But we had to pay about $800 to the tribe for permit fees. We had one cancellation at the last minute and stopped in at the Hualapai Lodge in Peach Springs on the first day to get a refund. They took down our information and said they would call us about it, and would probably give us a refund. But they didn't give the money to us right then and they have not called. It might be better to wait and pay on the way to the river, I don't know. We had the vehicles shuttled, which cost $140 per vehicle. I don't see how they can make money on it at that rate. But the axle broke and one of the wheels broke off of one of the trailers during the shuttle. When we arrived at South Cove one trailer was sitting on the other one. I don't know that the same thing wouldn't have happened if we had done our own shuttle, but it was odd that the trailer did ok when it was loaded, but then broke when it was empty. Even so, I would probably use the shuttle service again next time. We didn't have to use 4wd at Diamond Creek, but on a different day you might need to. We had to drive in the water some, and on cobbles and sand. Before going on this trip, I joined the yahoo group "Rafting Grand Canyon". I got a lot of very usful information from this list serve. Special thanks go to those who answered my questions about this section of canyon.